Interview with Bart Sibrel
On Faking Mankind's Greatest Accomplishment
Bart Sibrel has spent over thirty years working to expose the Apollo moon landings as a hoax. A filmmaker by trade, he understands how images are constructed — how lighting, backdrops, and camera angles can make fake scenes look real. That professional eye is central to his analysis. His documentaries, including A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon, present classified footage showing the astronauts faking part of the mission. His book Moon Man documents eyewitness testimony, suspicious deaths, and the technical impossibilities that make the official story untenable.
His journey began at age fourteen, when he saw Bill Kaysing — a former NASA contractor with high-level security clearance — appear on Oprah and explain that the moon landings were fabricated. Until that moment, Sibrel had been a true believer. His father, an Air Force officer, had received a VIP package of commemorative Apollo photographs, and Sibrel had mounted them on his wall like a shrine, looking at them thousands of times over a decade. After seeing Kaysing, he went back to those photographs with different eyes. What he noticed — soil changing color and focus, shadows that didn’t behave like sunlight — set him on a path he has never left. He has paid a real price for this work, personally and professionally.
Most interviews with Sibrel follow a familiar pattern: he presents the evidence, the host pushes back, and the conversation circles around whether or not it really happened. This interview takes a different approach. Rather than relitigating the evidence, it accepts the premise as a framework and explores the questions that follow: why they would have done it, what was stolen from the public, why six missions instead of one, how cold war propaganda became a lie institutions are now trapped inside, and what happens to a society when its founding myth turns out to be false. It examines the spiritual dimension of the hoax — pride, the Tower of Babel — and asks what it has cost him to pursue this for three decades.
The timing is relevant. NASA’s Artemis program, meant to return astronauts to the moon, has faced repeated delays. Elon Musk has acknowledged that reaching the moon today would require thirty times the fuel of the original Apollo missions. A new generation is encountering this material through documentaries like Massimo Mazzucco’s American Moon. Whatever you believe about what happened in 1969, the questions Sibrel raises — about institutional deception, national mythology, and the price of truth-telling — are worth sitting with.
With thanks to Bart Sibrel.
This is a transcript of a live interview. Any errors are my own.
Support Independent Research
This work remains free because paid subscribers make it possible. If you find value here, consider joining them.
What paid subscribers get: Access to the Deep Dive Audio Library — 180+ in-depth discussions (30-50 min each) exploring the books behind these essays. New discussions added weekly. That’s 100+ hours of content for less than the price of a single audiobook.
[Upgrade to Paid – $5/month or $50/year]
Get in touch Essay ideas, stories, or expertise to share: unbekoming@outlook.com
1. Bart, you’ve been investigating this subject for over thirty years now. Please take us back to the beginning — what first made you question the moon landings, and what convinced you to dedicate so much of your life to this?
I grew up believing that the moon landings were real, like most people — perhaps even to a greater degree than most. My father was in the Air Force. Though I was four years old and asleep in bed at the time of the first landing, he later received a VIP package of commemorative photographs allegedly from the surface of the moon. Those pictures became my prized possession. I put them up, maybe twenty pictures altogether, like a shrine to the moon landing. We moved about every two years, and wherever we went, there the pictures were.
From the age of about four to fourteen, I looked at those pictures over 10,000 times — not only believing they were real, but really worshipping them, mesmerized, hypnotized by the fantasy of men walking on another world.
Then at age fourteen, I saw a television interview on Oprah — one of Oprah Winfrey’s first guests — a gentleman by the name of Bill Kaysing. He had the second-highest security clearance to Wernher von Braun, the Nazi rocket designer. Kaysing would edit confidential memos going from von Braun to the Pentagon, English not being von Braun’s native language, and grammar not being the West Point graduates’ forte at the Pentagon. In the process, he read a memo from von Braun warning the Pentagon that the likelihood of meeting Kennedy’s goal by the end of the decade — to go to the moon on the first attempt with untried 1960s technology — was only a 1 in 10,000 chance.
If you can imagine, reaching the South Pole, just here on Earth, took six attempts to land successfully. No aviation accomplishment has ever worked on the first occasion. Not the Wright Brothers’ plane, nothing. It’s never happened in the history of aviation that the first time they tested a vehicle, it worked — except for the most complicated one of all time.
That’s what led Kaysing to realize: if they went to the moon when he read that they couldn’t, then they must have falsified it. If you play poker, you know you can win with a bad hand if you just pretend you have a good hand. That’s what they did.
That planted the seed in my mind. After I watched that interview, I went back to my shrine of Apollo pictures and started looking at them with critical eyes. There’s a saying: eyes wide shut. Sure enough, there was a part of each picture, horizontally left to right, where the soil was real and grayish colored, and then it would suddenly change color and focus — a fake backdrop.
Fast forward ten years. I’m twenty-four years old, and as serendipity would have it, I’m editing a project for the producer of that TV show I saw ten years earlier — whose guest said we didn’t go to the moon, who worked at NASA for six years during the Apollo program. I asked him to put me in touch with Kaysing, just for personal curiosity. It seemed odd that there was at least a possibility that the federal government faked mankind’s greatest accomplishment. I thought that merited investigation.
Being a filmmaker, whose job is to make fake scenes look real, I can show you one picture where shadows run parallel in sunlight on the left, and on the right, shadows intersect at 90 degrees from objects five feet apart — proving electrical light, which means they’re on Earth, which means they didn’t go to the moon. From a filmmaker’s point of view, and technically scientific and mathematical as well, you can prove the moon missions are fake with one photograph.
Kaysing suggested I produce a documentary about it. I took off about six months to do research, paid myself a salary out of savings, did nothing but research it. I found more than suspicious photographs. I found out that the administrator of NASA, who would have been able to boast on his resume this great accomplishment, resigned days before the first Apollo mission. Two of the three astronauts on the first mission refused to be interviewed about it unless the president personally asked them to.
The Soviets had spent five hours in space for every one hour we spent. By the time we had ten hours in space, they had already spent fifty hours. They did every milestone first: the first satellite, the first animal, the first man, the first woman, the first spacewalk, the first crew of three, the first rendezvous of two spacecraft. And never once tried to go to the moon.
There’s never been a scientific breakthrough — like flying across the Atlantic, breaking the sound barrier, splitting the atom — that no one on Earth could repeat fifty years later. The fact that the fifty-year-later ability is one-thousandth of what they claimed fifty years earlier — that would be like Lindbergh in 1927 flying 3,000 miles across the Atlantic, and fifty-five years later, in 1982, not a single airplane anywhere on Earth can fly across the Atlantic, and the very best airplane can only fly three miles. That’s what NASA is claiming: that they went a thousand times farther in 1969 with one-millionth the computing power of a cell phone than they can do today, with five decades of better rockets and computers, which can only go one-thousandth as far.
You can’t have greater technology in the past than in the future. You put that with shadows intersecting at 90 degrees, and classified footage of them faking being halfway to the moon, and eventually an eyewitness who confessed to participating in it — I thought there seemed to be at least a one-in-four chance that they faked going to the moon.
You seem like a nice guy, but if the police came to me and said you’re one of four neighbors and one of you is a homicidal maniac, that’s a pretty strong possibility to warrant a little bit of fear whenever we’re out having a beer together. To me, one-in-four odds that they faked the moon landing was extremely high, considering the historical magnitude of it.
Ever since I was a kid, I’ve liked puzzles — mazes especially. I used to draw mazes as well as a fourth-grader could. I also have this relentless, never-give-up personality. I talk to God sometimes in my own mind, and he kind of sounds like the perfect me, the sinless me, talking back. I asked him once, God, why do you put up with me? I would have smited me a long time ago. And he answered: because you never give up. You’re that person who falls off the horse a hundred times and gets back on a hundred times.
So you combine that with someone who loves puzzles, I said to myself: if anyone could figure out if they went to the moon or not, it’d be me. Then I thought, if they faked it and I start overturning these rocks, it could be dangerous. Do I really want to risk my life for what Nixon did in 1969? I want to have a wife and a family someday. I think I’ll pass.
Shortly thereafter, I had a client who was a famous Christian musician. They said they would get one of my scripts to a famous filmmaker in Hollywood if I did them a favor — which was to read the Bible. They got me a Bible divided into 365 daily reads. I started June 3rd, 1989, the day the man stood in front of the tanks in China. For the next five years, I read the Bible five times cover to cover. I wasn’t a Christian by any means, but it did develop in me the sense that things don’t make themselves. A car engine doesn’t make itself. And evolution really says a lower form of life made a higher form of life — so something without a brain made a brain, which is the exact opposite of logic.
Then I realized: if they faked the moon landing, that’s more significant historically than if they had actually gone. Either they planted a flag, came back, that was a close one — even though we can’t do it fifty-five years later — or the most powerful nation on Earth falsified mankind’s greatest accomplishment and murdered their own people to cover it up. If that’s true, that’s so much more profound than if they had actually gone.
And I realized I’m gonna die anyway. It is worth dying for, because if they faked the moon landing, it’s an important truth. It’s like the world has cancer and that truth is being hidden from them. As long as it’s an official narrative in the encyclopedia that the moon missions are real, those people are running the world. And those people running the world are killing people who get in their way. Their salaries are paid by our tax dollars to the assassins — CIA agents who murdered some of the Apollo astronauts. Not my testimony — it’s the testimony of the dead Apollo astronauts’ relatives.
So I changed my mind and started producing my film, A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon, under the theory that it might be true. Days later, as serendipity would have it a third time, I met a millionaire who builds rockets for NASA, who gave me a million dollars to produce these films because he thought it was his patriotic duty to expose it.
Three and a half years into the seven-year project, I found footage that says at the leader: “Do not show to the public.” They’re faking part of the mission right in front of your eyes, dated two days into the flight, with a third track of audio of the CIA telling them how to fake it better. That’s what convinced me. It’s what convinced two NBC news directors — they totally agreed it proves they did not go to the moon. They were threatened with the FCC unplugging them if they broadcast it.
I wish they went to the moon. That would be a much better world to live in. But anyone who goes from worshipping the moon missions, to having an open mind, to having a little bit of doubt, and finally finds concrete proof that they didn’t go — this footage — and then since the film came out, we have an eyewitness who saw them film the first moon landing on a fake lunar set at Cannon Air Force Base, June 1st, 2nd, and 3rd of 1968, who also confessed to killing somebody to cover it up as he was dying and wanting to get right with God.
So we have four times the proof necessary: intersecting shadows, the fact that you cannot have greater technology in the past than in the future, footage of them faking being halfway to the moon with a one-foot model of the Earth, and an eyewitness who saw them fake it and gave us a list of fifteen people who were there at the time.
I wish the moon missions were real. The world would be a better place. But the fact that they did fake it, and they’re still denying it, means those criminals are at large, and that’s very dangerous. The best tool to bring down the corruption is to expose the moon landing fraud. Yet politicians who claim they’re anti-corruption will not use the best tool in their arsenal because they’re afraid it will embarrass America. Well, a lot of people know it was fake. That’s an embarrassment. To correct that would be honorable.
2. Bill Kaysing’s 1975 book We Never Went to the Moon was foundational for you. How do you view it now, all these years later — what holds up, and what would you build on or revise?
I was watching a documentary last night about Wyatt Earp in the Western days and his battle against outlaws. He went from being a hero to being accused of murder. He was brought to trial with threat of being hung — by the criminals he was trying to eradicate, because they went on the stand, put their hand on the Bible, and swore that he cold-blooded killed this and that person, which apparently completely never happened. They bribed ten or twenty witnesses who said under oath that Wyatt Earp pulled the trigger in cold blood. But it was all a lie.
The world being run by a bunch of liars who are in cahoots with one another is something we just have to live with. I’ve heard judges say something along the lines of: just because a person is under oath doesn’t mean they’re telling the truth. You have to use your own discernment.
Meeting Bill Kaysing and talking to him, it only takes a few seconds to determine he’s a genuine article. Once that’s established, what he has to say is highly credible. He did have very high security clearance. He did edit memos from von Braun to the Pentagon. He did read a memo that said it was only a one-in-10,000 chance to succeed on the first occasion. He did see every protocol being run at NASA was the exact opposite of what you would do if you were really going to the moon.
Everything was departmentalized. A huge department just to make the glove, a huge department just to make the door handle. As soon as one group became proficient at whatever they were doing, they pulled them out and put in a bunch of people who had never done it before. They kept doing that over and over again so no one could see the full picture. Everyone was just assuming that every other part worked.
People were watering down this super-high-quality alcohol used to clean rocket components and getting high on the job. Complete departments were forgotten about for months — they sat around getting drunk and playing chess all day and getting a paycheck. In fact, the man who was going to be the first man to walk on the moon, Virgil Grissom, who was murdered by the CIA for not participating in the fraud according to his own family — he said they couldn’t even get a wired intercom to work between two buildings. So how are they possibly going to go to the moon?
In my film, there’s a quick segment where Neil Armstrong is in front of reporters on a mock lunar set to demonstrate how it would be for him to pick up the first rock sample. This is like six weeks before going to the moon for the very first time. He has a pole with a bag on the end of it, and the bag breaks off. They can’t get a stick with a bag on the end of it to work. That’s what Bill Kaysing saw also.
His book and subsequent garage-quality documentaries were basically my research material — reading everything I could from anyone who asserted that it was a fraud, and watching every community-access television-quality video about it, and from there piecing together the various pieces and trying to make a professional film about it.
I was producing the film under the theory it might be true that they faked it. I figured we’ll never know for sure, and I was wrong. We found footage that Bill Kaysing believes was sent to us by a whistleblower. They’re faking part of the mission right in front of your eyes, the lights come up, it’s a one-foot model of the Earth, and I’m like, oh my gosh, they actually did fake the moon landing. How sad is that?
I call him the grandfather of the moon landing fraud. He’s a highly credible eyewitness to the fraud — even though he wasn’t there when it was filmed, he saw everything falling into place to perpetrate it: the motive, means, and opportunity. One of the things he said was that it was supervised by the United States Air Force. And lo and behold, our eyewitness was the Chief of Security at the Air Force’s Intelligence Division base, which is where they filmed the first fake moon landing.
3. Most interviews ask you to prove the moon landings were faked. I want to try something different. Assuming the hoax occurred, why do you believe they did it?
There are a lot of benefits for the criminals who were faking the moon landing. The first people in the military who told me it was fake said it’s really just money. It’s an equivalent today of about $250 billion. If they’re only orbiting the Earth — and here we are fifty-five years later and they still cannot leave Earth orbit — then they’re probably only using 20% of the budget and keeping 80% of it. That’s extraordinary. That’s like $200 billion Congress could spend on things, or the president or the CIA could spend on things that Congress didn’t approve — like going into Cambodia, Laos, and all that, which we have eyewitnesses of. That was funded by the front of the moon missions.
I believe it was possible to fool the Soviets and China, at least temporarily, that the U.S. had the capability of going to the moon, which may have balanced out the mutually assured destruction of a future potential nuclear war. Later, I believe they found out and are blackmailing the United States. One of the reasons defenders say it must be real is that the Russians or Chinese would have blurted it out, but I know someone who works in the Chinese Space Agency who says everybody there knows the moon missions are fake. They’re blackmailing NASA. Congress forbade NASA to send any space technology to China, but they’re doing it anyway so that the Chinese won’t expose the moon landing fraud.
Then you had pride. America boasted that they would go by the end of the decade, and they couldn’t do it. That would be a humiliation. The scriptures warn that pride comes before a fall. The Tower of Babel — the reason they said they were gonna build it is to show off, to make a name for ourselves. The trip to the moon is kind of the modern-day equivalent of the Tower of Babel.
Richard Nixon said the number one threat to America during his first term was not China, not Russia, but American protesters protesting the corruption in the federal government, mainly against the Vietnam War. He said that’s the biggest threat to our country. So this was a pep rally. If you fake the moon missions, then you can guarantee that they’ll be successful — 100% guarantee, because you filmed it a year in advance. That gives the public something to cheer about.
The difference with this fraud: you can change the hat on who killed JFK and why, but it’s still a tragedy. You can change the hat on 9/11, who did it and why, but it’s still a tragedy. This is a positive lie. People have Stockholm Syndrome to the greatest degree. They’re defending their own criminals who are deceiving them and embezzling from them and murdering their own family members to cover up this particular fraud. It gave America something to cheer about.
But if you really get down to the core reason why they did it, it was likely the same reason President Clinton gave when he was asked why he had the affair — which, mind you, he denied twenty times. I did not, I did not, I did not, until he got caught. Okay, I did. Then someone asked why, and he said: because I could. Because I could get away with it.
According to Robert Kennedy Jr., who has more access to the JFK files than Oliver Stone, he is 100% certain that the CIA killed their own president because he was going to shut down their agency. Then Robert McNamara said the public was against the war in Vietnam. He went to the CIA and said we need something like Pearl Harbor. So they fabricated a fake attack on an American ship in the Gulf of Tonkin. He said later it just never happened. Congress passed a law starting the war on an event that never happened.
They’re willing to kill their own president. They’re willing to kill 58,000 of their own soldiers. I don’t think they’re gonna have a problem faking a video image. Why did they do it? Because they could. Because they’re arrogant. They got away with killing Kennedy in front of 200 eyewitnesses.
In my book, I show the Zapruder film synchronized with CBS Evening News’ description of it. They refused to show it — they just said, trust us as we describe it for you. Dan Rather says, in the third and fatal shot, Kennedy’s head goes violently forward, when actually it goes violently backward, right in front of your eyes as it’s synchronized with his description. He said the exact opposite of the truth on the evening news in 1963. A few years later, the same people in government said the exact opposite of the truth: they’re on the moon, when in fact they were on Earth.
Why did they do it? Because they could get away with it. They killed the president, they faked the war, and there’s no independent press coverage — just a TV picture controlled by them. People in the command center can’t even tell the difference between a real and a simulated flight, according to the flight director. So they could get away with it. That’s why they did it.
4. There’s an idea that all lies are a form of theft — they take something from the person being lied to, even if nothing physical changes hands. If the moon landings were faked, what do you think was stolen from us?
That’s an interesting concept. I do open my book with talking about a lie being a different form of crime than most. If you kill somebody, you have the body, and the widow, and orphaned children. If you steal something — let’s say your big-screen TV — then there’s that empty space on your wall, and there it is over at my place. But when you lie, where is it? You can’t put your hand on it. How many people are in jail for telling a lie? Very few.
You have world leaders who swear they will not do this if they’re elected president, and six weeks after they’re elected president, they do what they swore they would never do. Somehow they’re not thrown in jail immediately for twenty years. Somehow it just goes on like that’s normal.
I never thought about it before. What is it that they’re stealing from you? My first thought is you’re receiving something counterfeit. If you give me a counterfeit $100 bill, I might be able to get away with passing it on — I hate to say it, but I hopefully will, because I don’t want to be out $100. But I could get stuck with it. If the lights come up and it’s scrutinized, basically what was stolen from me would be $100.
In the event of the moon landing fraud, what was taken from us, number one, is our honor. I get threatening emails, death threats, from people foaming at the mouth, saying how dare you say the U.S.’s great accomplishment of putting a man on the moon was falsified.
I talked to a college professor teaching aerospace at one of the United States’ most prestigious universities, who said even if Neil Armstrong confessed on national TV that the moon missions were fake, he’d still think he walked on the moon anyway. So people have made an irrational, false god out of this. People are foaming at the mouth that I come along and say their idol is false — that their team cheated to win the Super Bowl. But they did.
5. One successful mission wins the space race. But there were six. Why repeat it? Was the Apollo program a mechanism for creating black budgets — money that could be funneled into projects that couldn’t be publicly acknowledged?
Let’s just say you and I are robbers, and there’s a bank that drops off half a million dollars every day. Every Sunday they forget to lock the back door. So we go in one Sunday, steal the money, and for some reason they lose the paperwork. They don’t even notice the money is gone. They got so much money they don’t keep up with it. We got away with it — Apollo 11.
So what are you doing next Sunday? Might as well get another half a million. What are you doing next Sunday? Another half a million. What are you doing next Sunday? Another half a million.
That just shows you the sheer arrogance of it. They should have quit while they were ahead, as they say, but they just kept on doing it. They kept raking in the dough. Yes, it’s a front. What is the government doing with that money? No one knows.
The Pentagon has never passed an audit. Never. Congress required them to do an audit in 1996, and twenty years later they still had not done an audit. They just refused. Then Congress passed a law mandating an audit, and for twenty years they ignored that law. No one went to jail, no one lost their job. When they finally did an audit twenty years later, they never passed one. They said there’s up to $23 trillion missing. We’re not sure where it is. I forgot where I put it, but it’s around here somewhere.
So yeah, it’s a front, obviously.
6. In the context of the cold war, this could be seen as war propaganda — a psychological operation against the Soviets that the public happened to witness. Do you think it’s become a lie they’re now trapped inside? That even if elements within NASA or government wanted to come clean, they can’t?
Anyone can do what they want to do. We’re not robots. I can walk down a street and jump off a bridge or not jump off a bridge. I can go to the left or the right. Coercion is not the same thing as being forced to do something.
That’s why I changed my mind from originally turning down the project to expose this fraud for fear it could cost me my life — realizing I’m gonna die anyway. People have to realize: even if there is no God, they’re going to be remembered for all time as a selfish coward if they don’t come forward.
Yes, it could easily come out if someone in the government came forward. They need to be granted amnesty, and the truth needs to come out. It’s terrible. They stole the honor. That’s what they stole. They stole the honor of the United States. We are no longer an honorable country. Not since they killed Kennedy, not since they started a war with no provocation, not since they falsified the moon landing and murdered people to cover it up.
They stole our honor. The only way that honor and integrity can be restored is to tell the truth about it. God can forgive, and man can forgive with pardons, but you have to confess in order to be forgiven, in order to make things right.
We have this government that is extremely unfaithful to their people. I cannot believe Wikipedia acknowledges that Operation Northwoods existed during the Kennedy administration — where people at the Pentagon said, hey, I have a great idea, why don’t we kill 200 Americans at random, blame it on Cuba, and we’ll have an excuse to go to war with Cuba. And the candidate said no thank you, when he should have said: anyone who thinks that’s a great idea, raise your hand, and everyone who raised their hand should be carted off to jail for attempted murder.
This type of government is only getting worse. The only way to restore that honor is to tell the truth. There’s a saying, very famous: the truth will make you free. So if the truth makes us free, then lies make us slaves. America is actually the most enslaved nation on Earth.
They say human slavery is more prevalent now than at any other time in the history of the world. If that were somebody’s business, what would be the best way to have a slave? Trick them into thinking that they are free.
I’ll tell you: there’s a country out there where 70% of the population is sick all the time. That country obviously has the worst healthcare in the world, right? Actually, that’s the United States of America, because 70% of the population is taking prescription medicine. Seventy percent of the population is sick all the time. If you remove cancer and heart disease, the third leading acknowledged cause of death is medical malpractice. So the United States has the worst healthcare in the world, and they’re told by their leaders they have the best. They’re told the moon missions are real. They’re told Oswald killed Kennedy, not us. The very people who did it are the ones in charge of the investigation. That’s how corrupt it is.
The second-to-last chapter of the Bible reminds us, one more time, of a list of common sins that will prevent us from entering eternal life: drunkenness, sexual immorality, lying, stealing. But you know what the first one is? The cowardly will not inherit the kingdom of God.
I turned down this project for fear of death. I was a coward. Hebrews 2:15 says that Lucifer holds all of mankind in slavery because of their fear of death. Why did billions of people recently take a medicine for an illness they didn’t even have? Fear of death.
Those people who could come forward — they’re gonna die anyway. Do they want to be remembered for all of history, or on Judgment Day before God, as being a coward who loved their boat and their home and their paycheck and their job more than doing what is right?
I interviewed one of the Apollo astronauts. I said, what kind of security clearance do you have? He said, top secret. I wondered why an Apollo astronaut on a civilian mission has top secret clearance. I said, top secret clearance means you cannot tell your wife, your children, your church members, your pastor what’s really going on. He said, that’s true. I said, so that means you would lie to your wife, and to your children, and to your pastor, and to your church congregation, in order to keep a secret of the corrupt federal government. He said, yeah.
The world is run by a bunch of liars. How sad that mankind’s greatest accomplishment is a lie in a fallen world. But it’s kind of poetic in a disgusting way. It’s ironic. It kind of fits with the fallen nature of America and mankind. It could be set right, and may be set right, if someone comes forward. We have to love God — or what is right — more than men. We have to be willing to die for what is right, because we’re gonna die anyway. So we might as well die for what is right.
7. NASA keeps delaying Artemis, meanwhile there’s endless talk of Mars colonization — Musk, NASA timelines, the whole cultural momentum. Given the Van Allen radiation problem, do you think any of this is real, or is it all theater?
It’s a little bit of both. I know two people who work on the Artemis program, and they say there’s nothing that would ever make them believe man went to the moon in 1969. They are so far behind schedule.
I got an email three or four years ago: “So, Bart, what are you gonna do when they have men walking on the moon next year?” I said, look, I’m sorry, it’s not gonna happen. Got an email a month ago: “So, Bart, what are you gonna do when Artemis has people walking on the moon later this year?” I said, it’s not gonna happen. I’ll bet anybody a million dollars, and I’ll give them a million-to-one odds. They will not walk on the moon on schedule.
They’ve postponed returning to the moon ten times. Reagan said they’d return in five years. Bush Sr. said it. Clinton said it twice. Bush Jr. said it twice. Obama said it. Trump said it twice. They still cannot go to the moon with five decades of better technology.
When they blew up the first atomic bomb, I think it was just ten years later that atomic bombs were 1,000 times more powerful. So if they could go to the moon on the first attempt with one-millionth the computing power of a cell phone, we would have been on Mars ten years later, we’d be in another solar system by now, and there’d be bases all over the moon like the South Pole. There are bases at the South Pole because it’s humanly possible. If it were humanly possible to go to the moon in 1969, there’d be bases all over there now. There aren’t any, because it can’t be done.
The radiation belt that most people don’t know about is one of the obstacles. Elon Musk just said that in order to go to the moon today, it’s gonna take fifteen fuel trips first. Mind you, his rocket is three stories taller than the Apollo rocket, and if you put booster fuel tanks on the side, it carries twice as much fuel. So now, for some reason, it takes thirty times the fuel minimum in order to leave Earth orbit and have enough fuel to go to the moon and come back.
I assure you, they’re not going to make the rocket one ounce heavier or one inch taller than it has to be to minimally get the job done. So if that’s what it takes now, that’s what it took back then. We have von Braun saying it on camera: the largest rocket can only achieve Earth orbit, and you have to make multiple fuel trips after that. We have him saying it in writing. We have Elon Musk saying it now. We have a NASA engineer saying the radiation between here and the moon is dangerous, and the technology for a person to go through it and survive has not been invented yet.
If I can go from worshipping the moon landings to being their greatest critic, it’s only the truth that could make such a conversion. These other people don’t have an open mind. Like I said, a college professor said if Neil Armstrong confessed on national TV that the missions were fake, he would still think he walked on the moon anyway. I thought this guy was a scientist. Objective. They are worshipping the moon landing.
I get emails threatening to kill me and my family with fire. “I wish I could watch you and your family burn alive before my eyes.” Got an email that said that. Anyone that irrational cannot perceive the truth. Which means they’re wrong and I’m right.
Do you have any specific thoughts on Musk and the whole Mars thing?
Musk is, I’m sure, wiser than me. There’s a saying: don’t bite the hand that feeds you.
About twelve years ago, I was getting about $800 a month from YouTube revenue from my movies — that probably now would be $2,000 or more. Then I criticized YouTube, and the next day they shut that off. That was probably stupid on my part. I’ve got a family to feed. I should have tried to play ball and realized they are providing me this service and income. Maybe I needed to tread lightly. Would have been the wiser thing to do. Elon Musk is doing that.
He has said it’s gonna take thirty times the fuel to go to the moon. That’s an admission. He said the Apollo claim is a scientific and historical anomaly, meaning out of place and illogical. He landed a rocket vertically with 600 million times more computing power than the lunar lander. With 600 million times more computing power to land a rocket vertically, it blew up the first time, blew up the second time, blew up the third time, blew up the fourth time. It took five attempts to land a rocket vertically. Yet somehow, with one-600-millionth the computing power, they landed six times vertically on the moon.
So he has indirectly said three different ways that the moon missions are fake, but he’s not gonna bite the hand that feeds him. He has to launch from a NASA-approved site or federal government-approved site. If he goes around saying the moon missions are fake, that’s not gonna happen.
8. The Soviets were ahead in virtually every measure of the space race. They never attempted a manned moon landing and never exposed ours as fake. And now, decades later, the original cold war pressures are gone and the principals are mostly dead — yet the silence continues. How do you interpret that?
They’re being blackmailed. The U.S. is being blackmailed. I have a friend who works inside the Chinese Space Agency, and he says everybody there knows the moon missions are fake. They likely have reconnaissance pictures of the landing sites where nothing is there. He says they’re blackmailing the United States. Congress passed a law saying the government, NASA, or whoever cannot sell space technology to China. It’s illegal. But according to my source, NASA is giving them that technology — their space station is a complete clone of the U.S. space station. They’ve given them all the blueprints and everything in exchange for not blowing the whistle about the Apollo fraud.
Same with Russia. On my homepage, sibrel.com, there’s a video of Vladimir Putin being shown the results of the AI that said every Apollo picture was fake. He doesn’t look surprised at all. In fact, he looks afraid that if the truth came out, maybe he wouldn’t be able to blackmail the United States anymore.
People just make an assumption. They assume that China or Russia would blurt it out that we didn’t go to the moon, but they’re more shrewd than that. It’s much more valuable to blackmail people.
Then they say, well, it must be true because you can’t keep a secret from 400,000 people if you add every person who sold paperclips from every company associated to the third generation of making the Apollo equipment. Well, that’s like saying the 400,000 bank tellers know the same about the corruption in the bank as the CEO knows. No, they don’t.
The flight director, Eugene Kranz, told me that someone working in the command center cannot tell the difference between a real flight and a rehearsal flight. They’re all the same to them — just a bunch of numbers going by on a screen. If someone in the command center can’t tell the difference, then we certainly can’t tell the difference if we’re born years after the fact, or as a child watching it on TV in our living room.
People are in denial because it’s a positive lie. They want America to be great. They want science to be great. They want us to win the Super Bowl. I’d rather just know the truth. If I have cancer, please tell me.
9. Massimo Mazzucco’s documentary American Moon came out in 2017 and has become a significant reference point. What’s your assessment of it?
I actually haven’t seen the whole film. I started watching it about two or three months ago. It’s like three and a half hours long. Massimo and I have talked over Zoom, and he’s like, Bart, why don’t you watch my movie? I said, look, that’s a lot of time, and I already know they didn’t go to the moon. I don’t need, no offense, to waste three and a half hours to know something I already know.
I finally got around to starting it as part of my research. I’ve watched the first hour and a half so far. Looks good to me. I think it could be simplified dramatically — everything can be simplified. On my homepage, there’s a three-minute video, how you can prove the moon missions are fake in three minutes.
He was mad at me. “I can’t believe you’re not gonna watch it.” I was like, I’m sure it’s great, but getting three and a half hours all at once is difficult. I already know they didn’t go. It’s like when people send me links to debunking videos. I haven’t watched a single debunking video, because I know they faked it. I have four times the proof.
I was doing one of these interviews — Danny Jones, I think — and he brings up this debunking video. I’m looking in the lower right-hand corner: it’s like two and a half hours long. This was after I did the Joe Rogan interview. I’m thinking: okay, so if they went to the moon, then the amount of evidence that I should have is zero. So a debunking video should be zero minutes and zero seconds. Why is it two and a half hours long to beat down the emerging evidence that they actually did fake the moon landings?
If they went to the moon, why would anyone care what morons think? If I go around saying Mickey Mouse is the first president, do you think there’d be a thousand videos to debunk me? To reassure people? No. The fact that they have to defend this proves it’s made out of straw. Otherwise, it would speak for itself.
One of the good things about Massimo’s documentary is that he almost steel-mans the debunkers and treats them seriously, then debunks the debunkers.
Yeah, I’m an hour and a half in. It looks good.
The most powerful thing I found was at the end — extended footage of the astronauts’ first interview. You actually get to see the astronauts talking to the press after their trip. That, for me — of all the evidence — that was it. That’s not the demeanor of someone who’s just come back from the moon.
Moreover, it is the demeanor of a bunch of people lying who wish they weren’t lying.
10. There’s persistent speculation about Stanley Kubrick’s involvement — that he directed the footage in exchange for funding and creative freedom. What’s your view on the Kubrick claims?
I never say in my movie or in the book the name Kubrick, not a single time. It’s speculation, and it’s irrelevant. No offense to the guy’s brilliant three-and-a-half-hour film, which I will watch, Lord willing. I already know they didn’t go. I don’t need another three and a half hours of convincing.
To me, it’s the same way: it doesn’t matter who filmed the fake moon landing sets. They were fake. You can speculate that Popeye did it, or Clinton did it, or Stanley Kubrick did it. Now, if you want my personal opinion, I’ve given it during interviews. I think I did one time, and immediately Kubrick’s daughter shows up on InfoWars and says, my dad would never do such a thing. I was eight years old at the time — actually it was filmed a year earlier, which means she was seven years old.
I remember when I was seven, my parents would have these cocktail parties and send us off to bed. I wonder what they were doing after that. For me to say, as a seven-year-old, I know my mom and dad would never do this or that — what some of the people in Eyes Wide Shut were doing, maybe my parents were doing that, who knows? To say a seven-year-old knows what their parents were doing at the time is a stretch.
She may be correct that he had a lot of integrity. That’s very possible. At the same time, what she doesn’t understand that I do as a filmmaker is his great intellect wanting a challenge. Once you climb Mount Everest and it’s the tallest mountain on Earth and you’re thirty years old with a long life ahead of you, it’s kind of a bummer. For him, being such a good filmmaker — one of the best, just beautiful simplicity in his films — what better intellectual high than to make a film so convincing that people think it’s real?
We know the moon missions are fake. We have fake footage of it, shadows intersecting at 90 degrees, an eyewitness who saw them film it at Cannon Air Force Base. So it was fake. Someone had to be in charge of the fake scenery. They had a couple of choices: they could hire the general over the media department at the Pentagon, who does promotional recruitment films — you’d have great security but amateur results. Or you could hire the best filmmaker on the planet, who coincidentally, in 1968, the year that the fake moon landing was filmed a year in advance, was shooting another movie about going to the moon.
2001: A Space Odyssey. There are pictures of him with the flight director and NASA administrator. It’s a fact that he filmed parts of Barry Lyndon under natural candlelight, which had never been done in the history of motion pictures, and he did so with a lens made by NASA.
I would have chosen the best filmmaker on the planet to get the short-term results of good-looking pictures and worry about security later. He did insist that his last film, Eyes Wide Shut, contractually open on a particular day. Warner Brothers didn’t understand why he had to have the film open on this day, but he wouldn’t sign the contract unless they agreed. It was the 30th anniversary of the launch to the moon — July 16th, 1999 — and he died before then.
He died, I believe, under mysterious circumstances. Several people I have been tracking died right at the age of seventy, like a predetermined old age before you can rant and tell the truth on your deathbed. I could never get a straight answer from the coroner about any question I asked about his death. He would have been my choice.
Maybe he filmed the first one and then they figured it out, because it wasn’t until two years later that they actually “went to the moon” again. The second mission, they allegedly pointed the video camera at the sun accidentally, so they only had video for one minute. No TV images for the second mission. Third mission, they claimed they weren’t able to go. So he had two years after Kubrick potentially showed them how to do it before they ended up doing it on their own.
He also developed a phobia about flying to America ever again. Never wanted to come to America again after that time.
Of course, he had that famous film Dr. Strangelove, which was about the United States Air Force and the B-52, which my father flew for thousands of hours. The B-52 was super top secret at the time he made the movie, and somehow he did such a close replica of the top-secret dashboard that they were afraid they might be charged with espionage. This originally pissed off the Air Force, but some of the people, from what I suspect, appreciated his genius — being able to pull it off and showing the humor in the top echelon of government.
One of the interesting things about Dr. Strangelove and the War Room scenes: these guys are just juvenile. The people who run the world are juvenile.
To fake the moon landing proves our leaders are juvenile. Kennedy, not a scientist, a visionary, set a scientific goal that couldn’t be reached on the deadline. NASA has never kept a schedule their entire history, except the most complicated mission of all time. They could have just told the truth. By not having the guts or the maturity to tell the truth, it proves they’re juvenile. So not only do we have gangsters running our country, and probably the world — they’re immature gangsters too, which is even more dangerous.
My source says the United States Air Force supervised the faking. Every branch of the military has their intelligence division. The Intelligence Division of the Air Force is located at Cannon Air Force Base, which was my source’s location. He was the Chief of Security at the most secure base. He saw them film the fake moon landing. He said so while he was dying. He said he even murdered somebody to cover it up. He said this hoping to get right with God. He saved a list of people who were on the VIP list, allowed to eyewitness it, that President Johnson personally gave him. We published that in my book.
So the Air Force was involved in Dr. Strangelove and in the faking of the moon landing. NASA was involved with 2001: A Space Odyssey and using forward projection technology for the fake backdrops. Kubrick would have been my choice. He was the logical choice. He chose the 30th anniversary as the date for his last film, Eyes Wide Shut. I mean, if I’m looking at those pictures 10,000 times and I think they’re on the moon when there’s pretty good evidence right in front of me — the soil changing colors, the soil changing focus, almost a straight line horizontally, the guy’s arm bent with wrinkles in the spacesuit when it should be pressurized — there are all these clues. My eyes were wide shut.
Then you have the little red room boy from The Shining who stands up wearing a custom-knit shirt that says Apollo 11 on it. I know you don’t want dear old dad to be a homicidal maniac — and they’re not, that’s not what they’re accusing Kubrick of. They’re only saying they tapped into his expertise to fake the moon landing.
She says he wouldn’t get involved in politics and lying to that degree. I don’t think a child can know that about their parent. My father was in the Air Force as an officer, and he did some horrendous things. I think Kubrick saw it as an intellectual challenge — climbing Mount Everest — that he could make a movie that people would think was real. What a high that was for him intellectually.
That’s what I suspect. It doesn’t really matter who shot it. The fact is they did fake it. But if you want to speculate, he’s a pretty good guess.
11. Some have called the moon landing a founding myth of modern America — almost religious in its cultural function. You’ve written about it in explicitly spiritual terms: pride, the Tower of Babel. What happens to a society when its founding myth turns out to be a lie?
That’s an excellent question. I don’t know, because it hasn’t happened yet.
But hopefully we’ll know, and there’s a hint of it. There’s a famous author, I think the most published female author in the world, and the most published female American author — Ellen White. She was part of the Adventist Church founders. She said about the Tower of Babel: the monument to their pride became a memorial of their folly.
Jesus said if you start building a tower and then you end up running out of money and it’s half completed there forever, then you look pretty much like a fool. That’s what the Tower of Babel not being finished was all about. Imagine it being said about Apollo: the monument to their pride became a memorial to their folly.
If you’re really patriotic, you’re willing to endure the insult of the truth about the moon landing fraud coming out, because the alternative is worse. We either take this blow and admit it — and you can blame it on other people who are dead, feel free — but we need to set the record straight.
There’s nothing wrong, in my opinion, with trying to go to the moon. I think maybe giving everybody on Earth concrete floors, indoor plumbing, and clean drinking water first might be a more compassionate use of the money. And then after that, maybe try to plant flags on lifeless rocks.
But telling the truth would be such a blessing to mankind. It would give us hope. Because right now, things are gonna fall apart pretty quickly. I suspect they’re just gonna keep postponing returning to the moon like they’ve done ten times before, until some asteroid strike or a worldwide pandemic, at which point no one will care who killed Kennedy or if the moon landings are real.
There’s hope that they will tell the truth. The rebuke of the Tower of Babel was known to the world. Then there was the Titanic, and they put in print: the ship that God himself cannot sink. If you can imagine. And then Richard Nixon didn’t even have the guts to show up for the launch. You have the President of Japan there, but not the President of the United States for the launch to the moon. He was too busy. He didn’t want a picture of him, for all time, grinning, shaking Neil Armstrong’s hand, for the truth of the fraud to unravel. Once they got away with it, he shows up for the second launch. Nevertheless, knowing it was fake, he said putting a man on the moon is second in greatness only to God making the universe. When he knew they weren’t there.
Maybe that rebuke will be known. Maybe that’s what God wants to happen in the last days. Maybe the delay between the truth coming out and the lie — imagine if the truth came out at that press conference in August, the following month after quarantine ended. They could have just said, look, they threatened to kill my wife and family. If someone could get on the phone to the local police and FBI and have them surround my house, I’d greatly appreciate it. I’m disgusted. I only participated to save the life of my family. We never left Earth orbit. It was filmed at Cannon Air Force Base. He could have done that. People would have gone, oh, that’s weird, okay, we’ll try not to let that happen again.
But imagine, after all these debunking videos, all these documentaries, all these Congressional Medals of Honor, going six times, for then the truth to come out. It’s like a couple where one of them is unfaithful in the first six weeks of marriage at a drunken party. They could tell their spouse then and say, divorce me if you will, but I just don’t want to live a lie. Or imagine if they told them on their 50th anniversary, after they’re an elder in the church and highly respected senior citizen of the community.
Maybe that’s why God has this delay — to show us all the more depth of our deception, and people with Stockholm Syndrome defending the people who are deceiving them, defending the people who are killing their relatives. Because it’s such a glorious lie, it’s flattery. The Bible says Lucifer uses flattery — telling people what they want to hear. You’re great, America’s great, NASA’s great, science is great. And people ignore the facts to the degree that a guy would say, if Neil Armstrong confessed and said it was fake, I’d still think he walked on the moon anyway. That guy teaches university. Who said that?
That’s the world we live in, and we have to accept that fact. If the truth comes out, prayerfully it will. It’d be a great, beautiful blessing to mankind. It would give us hope that maybe the world could turn around for the better.
12. You’ve been at this for over thirty years. What has it cost you?
I think it’s about $2.75.
No — a lot. I mean, who knew I would actually risk my life? I knew I was risking my life, but if you get the book, Moon Man, you’ll see I was abducted by government agents. I was drugged with something like truth serum. I escaped their custody, made my way back from CNN to Nashville, peeing in a cup to prove I’d been drugged, gave it to a friend to put in a lab to get the results. Days later he said the lab was broken into, and the only thing stolen was my urine sample. So they had the CIA tracking me, trying to get rid of all proof that they had abducted me, confiscated copies of the fake footage.
I was at the back door of CNN trying to get a copy of the fake footage to them, because the previous night when I found the footage, I was followed all over the place, everywhere I went. My car was disabled. My brakes were tampered with. My accelerator pedal was meant to stick when my brakes were disconnected. The light for the low brake fluid warning was disconnected too. They did a lot of things — this is all in my book.
I was disowned by my parents. I was kicked out of a church for embarrassing them, saying the moon landings are fake. So be it. If you’re a friend of the world, you’re an enemy toward God, is what the Bible says. Jesus said, blessed are you when they insult you for what is right. Great is your reward in heaven.
They did fake the moon landing. That’s the world we live in. The sooner we accept that, the better we’ll all be off.
13. After all your research, all the confrontations, all the years — what do you most want people to understand about this that they currently don’t?
These criminals are at large. You can’t have a neighborhood where one child disappears every thirty days, and it’s been going on for fifty-five years, and you just go, that’s just one of those things. No. This needs to stop.
The only way to stop it is to tell the truth about it. The only way to tell the truth about it is to love God more than men, to love what is right. To not care what the result will be, if it crashes the dollar temporarily, or the stock market. So what? Of course, if you cut off a gangrened limb, there’s gonna be sorrow and loss. But the body will recover and survive, because if you don’t get it off, the body’s gonna die.
People need to know that these people are at large, running the world. The deception and the arrogance is so much greater than people realize. They’re faking a moon landing when they didn’t even have to, because they arrogantly could get away with it, and then they did it six times, and then they murdered people to cover it up. This is the government that claims to be democratic.
Something’s wrong with this picture. If the bus is headed toward a cliff, you need to open people’s eyes and wake them up and show them that before it’s too late.
14. Where can people find your work, and what’s the best way to stay in touch with what you’re doing?
Just go to sibrel.com. You can get a copy of the book there. My book is interactive. There are about seventeen video links. I’ll write a chapter, and then I’ll say, go to sibrel.com, watch link 1, link 2. We back up everything I’m saying. We’ll show you the NASA engineer saying the technology to go to the moon has not been invented yet. We’ll show you the footage of them faking being halfway to the moon. We’ll show you the shadows intersecting. We’ll show you the testimony about the deathbed confession of where and when it was filmed.
As far as I know, it’s the first interactive book to do that. You can get all that information, even the videos for free, right now at sibrel.com.
Support Independent Research
This work remains free because paid subscribers make it possible. If you find value here, consider joining them.
What paid subscribers get: Access to the Deep Dive Audio Library — 180+ in-depth discussions (30-50 min each) exploring the books behind these essays. New discussions added weekly. That’s 100+ hours of content for less than the price of a single audiobook.
[Upgrade to Paid – $5/month or $50/year]
Get in touch Essay ideas, stories, or expertise to share: unbekoming@outlook.com
Bitcoin: 3Q6BK8x8zjoPaXykQggzvoJxg5FiEbkb3U
Ethereum: 0x4CB0d39d8466a34609318FC1B003B745893788b3
Book: Medicalized Motherhood: From First Pill to Permanent Patient
Available as a free download. 123 interventions documented across six phases—from pre-conception capture through postpartum surveillance. Includes practical tools: birth plan template, provider interview questions, quick reference card, and a new chapter on interrupting the cascade. Download it, share it with someone facing their first prenatal appointment, their induction date, their cesarean recommendation. The cascade works because women don’t see it coming. This book makes it visible.
New Biology Clinic
For those of you looking for practitioners who actually understand terrain medicine and the principles we explore here, I want to share something valuable. Dr. Tom Cowan—whose books and podcasts have shaped much of my own thinking about health—has created the New Biology Clinic, a virtual practice staffed by wellness specialists who operate from the same foundational understanding. This isn’t about symptom suppression or the conventional model. It’s about personalized guidance rooted in how living systems actually work. The clinic offers individual and family memberships that include not just private consults, but group sessions covering movement, nutrition, breathwork, biofield tuning, and more. Everything is virtual, making it accessible wherever you are. If you’ve been searching for practitioners who won’t look at you blankly when you mention structured water or the importance of the extracellular matrix, this is worth exploring. Use discount code “Unbekoming” to get $100 off the member activation fee. You can learn more and sign up at newbiologyclinic.com
The clincher for me was when I raised the question in my own mind and could not arrive at a logical answer. Where was the Porta-Potty and how did the astronauts access it?
Crammed into a space capsule the size of a small car and zipped into space suits which required assistance to enter and exit, how did they survive days and days of "holding" it? It's not like they could just let the flap down and do their business. Either human biology had to be fundamentally altered for the duration of the trip or... Or, what?
Are you going to believe me or your own damn lying common sense?
One inconvenient fact that is routinely ignored by the “colonize Mars” crowd is that mammals are unable to conceive in space. This has been studied since the early 1970s. Developmental neurobiologist Eliot Blass at Hopkins had an “interesting” research arm studying this issue, zero gravity fertility. Can’t do it even as of 2025. IVF fails. We are terrestial beings, our biology is tied to Earth. However, fooling the public into thinking we can colonize other planets makes the frivilous expenditures palatable. Great insight into the why of these deceptions: to justify money and then divert.